View Full Version : 9/11
WelshElite
01-06-07, 01:37 AM
Hey, dno if seal_scout has posted this already or told you it but its quite good :p
1) New York City has 11 letters
2) Afghanistan has 11 letters.
3) Ramsin Yuseb (The terrorist who threatened to destroy the Twin
Towers in 1993) has 11 letters.
4) George W Bush has 11 letters.
This could be a mere coincidence, but this gets more interesting:
1) New York is the 11th state.
2) The first plane crashing against the Twin Towers was flight number
11.
3) Flight 11 was carrying 92 passengers. 9 + 2 = 11
4) Flight 77 which also hit Twin Towers, was carrying 65 passengers.
6+5 = 11
5) The tragedy was on September 11, or 9/11 as it is now known. 9 + 1+ 1 = 11
6) The date is equal to the US emergency services telephone number
911. 9 + 1 + 1 = 11.
Sheer coincidence..?! Read on and make up your own mind:
1) The total number of victims inside all the hi-jacked planes was
254. 2 + 5 + 4 = 11.
2) September 11 is day number 254 of the calendar year. Again 2 + 5 + 4
= 11.
3) The Madrid bombing took place on 3/11/2004. 3 + 1 + 1 + 2 + 4 = 11.
4) The tragedy of Madrid happened 911 days after the Twin Towers
incident.
Now this is where things get totally eerie:
The most recognised symbol for the US, after the Stars & Stripes, is
the Eagle. The following verse is taken from the Quran, the Islamic
holy book:
"For it is written that a son of Arabia would awaken a fearsome Eagle.
The wrath of the Eagle would be felt throughout the lands of Allah and lo,
while some of the people trembled in despair still more rejoiced: for
the wrath of the Eagle cleansed the lands of Allah and there was
peace."
That verse is number 9.11 of the Quran.
Still uncovinced about all of this..?! Try this and see how you feel
afterwards, it made my hair stand on end:
Open Microsoft Word and do the following:
1. Type in capitals Q33 NY. This is the flight number of the first
plane to hit one of the Twin Towers.
2. Highlight the Q33 NY.
3. Change the font size to 48.
4. Change the actual font to the WINGDINGS
What do you think now?!!
Yep seen that real weird when i did the wingdings that was something.
SEAL_scout
01-06-07, 02:35 AM
yeah its crazy especially since I live in NEW YORK.:eek:
Element
01-06-07, 02:42 AM
http://www.hoax-slayer.com/wingdings-911.html :cool:
This has been a strange and disturbing thread... :)
In this day were born 11 kids uh is that too? Come on its just numbers, numbers and if you have good imagination you can put them where ever you can
Asakura
01-06-07, 01:42 PM
I've read about the Wingdings-thing and tried it myself. Most of the things Welsh posted sounded quite unreal though, and thanks to this...
http://www.hoax-slayer.com/wingdings-911.html :cool:
...we know it is. Well done "teammate" Element! ;)
Yeah I believe it's just a bunch of bull........... they are just trying to find conspiracies and things that point to the past, so they can blame who they want.
It does seem believable....... however I'm not sure what to actually think atm........ :s
WelshElite
01-06-07, 01:53 PM
Most of the things Welsh posted sounded quite unreal though,
I got this from seal_scout do don't blame me :p
Element
01-06-07, 05:17 PM
I've read about the Wingdings-thing and tried it myself. Most of the things Welsh posted sounded quite unreal though, and thanks to this...
...we know it is. Well done "teammate" Element! ;)
No problemo "team member" Asa.:)
Maybe it's a fake but it does is weird how it all end the same though.
Yes that is very weird, a sad day for my country overall:(
eyey guys no worries. We might be bombed, and have Gods against us, but im here to protect us! and i have a sniper rifle dammit!
Besides, with the Q33 NY the last sign (Y) isnt the sign of Islam, but the Jewish sign!
Spec_Operator
01-06-07, 09:03 PM
It looks like an explosion, thats the point i think
If thats so, it should be in front of the skull?
the devils work that day for sure :(
Spec_Operator
01-06-07, 11:09 PM
If thats so, it should be in front of the skull?
Well, nothing is perfect.
the devils work that day for sure
I remember the day... it was in our old house, i was playing i think, the tv was on and ive seen it then in tv...
i just got home from school, and when i turned the tellie on the crash was just there. I remember my exact words: Hvorfor i pokker sender man ikke heftige filmer på kvelden, istedet, når folk er hjemme?!"
Translation? "Why the -mean word- isnt good movies sent at evening, when people are home?!"
Spec_Operator
02-06-07, 03:25 PM
Sorry, i cant laugh.
I think the post was a hoax. All a hoax. Enders the skeptic :)
Ghost MacRoth
02-06-07, 09:57 PM
Read 'The Illuminati' by Robert Anton Wilson, then see if you think it's 'just' numbers. The universe is mathmatics, and numbers can teach you a lot.
Also, I think the symbols were meant to read as 'death to Isreal', as many extremist Arabs have trouble distinguishing between the US and Isreal. Let's face it, these days who doesn't?
It was 'a' devil's work for sure, but an Arab or Christian devil? There are many who believe the US government staged the attack to whip up support for their 'war on terror', or as it should be called 'war for oil, profit and power'.
y would the government do that??
You know americans they are loco *no affence :)
Yeah, i have heard stories about that, but you don't see it on the news :s i wander why ? :)
Anth3m there are a lot of corrupt people in politics and stuff, but I'm not saying i know who, i just have a feeling there are quite a few of them that are higher up, and most of them are rich, i wander how they get that way.
Sorry for the politician rant on here.
tctransporter:Yeah, i have heard stories about that, but you don't see it on the news :s i wander why ? :)
Anth3m there are a lot of corrupt people in politics and stuff, but I'm not saying i know who, i just have a feeling there are quite a few of them that are higher up, and most of them are rich, i wander how they get that way.
---------------------------------------------
thats how bad politics are today, they even kill thousands of people :mad: to get something done.
Yes very messed up are the polictics in are world:mad:
Ghost MacRoth
04-06-07, 12:41 AM
y would the government do that??
I'll say it again, 'Oil, profit, power'. :mad:
Why would I so quick to beleive it's possibly true? Simple. If I were a high up government official with 'sponsers' to please, and I saw that I could do a thing to increase my holdings, I would. Let's face it, none of those who died were connected to the politicians, so what the f*ck do they care what happens to them? JUst like all the poor sod's sent to 'fight' this war, who are also just ordinary people, and therefore do not matter. Look at George W. Bush, perfect example. Another time another war (Vietnam for those who may wonder) , but he avoided going to war 'cause his daddy was very rich and powerfull, a somebody. We proles mean nothing to those people, and they will sacrifice us in our thousands thinking even less of it than losing a pawn in chess.
Yea, i think you're right. With the ongoing conflict where they found no nuclear weapons, just alot of oil. I shouldnt really speak up, i made a pact with myself: Screw thinking!!
I dont wanna be a pawn, i guess a Delta Force Sniper at least has got to be a Tower, hm?
btw, SCREW IS NOT SWEARING, WES! GRR GRR GRRRR
Yea good posting McRoth :goodpost: and :omg: strange stuff has comed from this thread :p:D
lol talking about politics?? how did this happen on the sog forums :p
Yeah, doesnt fit in the regular superficial and pointless conversations. ;)
Ghost MacRoth
05-06-07, 03:37 PM
Oh but it is pointless!! Talking about it gets f**k all done, and unless we have any secret billionaires on the forum no one will be in any position to do anything about it!! It's just letting off steam really.
SEAL_scout
05-06-07, 09:03 PM
Oh but it is pointless!! Talking about it gets f**k all done, and unless we have any secret billionaires on the forum no one will be in any position to do anything about it!! It's just letting off steam really.
:lol2: I don't know about billionaires....but SOG has definitely got some millionaires.:boxer:
I am rich but my bro is not:p
Ghost MacRoth
05-06-07, 09:19 PM
Okay, the rich guys buy guns and give bribes to gain powerfull allies, Lucy and I will use the guns to defeat the armies of the world and SOG shall rule the earth under President Matt!! :p
Spec_Operator
05-06-07, 09:20 PM
......*fear* No, please not XD
what no ****ing ****ing way! Matt wouldnt be president, but a damn EMPEROR dammit!
I think its nothing special, taht could be done for any date, then only thing I find interesting and have for years, is that
1. 9/11 is our emergency number
2. the attack was in the general time frame 9:11 am
The rest are wierd, but like I said, we could do that for any date.
I'll say it again, 'Oil, profit, power'. :mad:
Why would I so quick to beleive it's possibly true? Simple. If I were a high up government official with 'sponsers' to please, and I saw that I could do a thing to increase my holdings, I would. Let's face it, none of those who died were connected to the politicians, so what the f*ck do they care what happens to them? JUst like all the poor sod's sent to 'fight' this war, who are also just ordinary people, and therefore do not matter. Look at George W. Bush, perfect example. Another time another war (Vietnam for those who may wonder) , but he avoided going to war 'cause his daddy was very rich and powerfull, a somebody. We proles mean nothing to those people, and they will sacrifice us in our thousands thinking even less of it than losing a pawn in chess.
I dont want to start a politics arguement, but what you said about his dad having money which kept him out of the Vietnam War is wrong.
George W. Bush was in the US National Guard, in which he serves on our soil, thus not going to Vietnam like the Army did.
SEAL_scout
12-06-07, 12:04 AM
George W. Bush was in the US National Guard, in which he serves on our soil, thus not going to Vietnam like the Army did.
Well i hate Bush because he really doesn't know what he is doing and he is finishing off his fathers war.
Well i hate Bush because he really doesn't know what he is doing and he is finishing off his fathers war.
Well like I said, Im not going to debate in here, I just wanted to make sure we all have accurate facts if we are talking about this stuff.
If he is finishing his father's war, then so was President Bill Clinton. Do your research and you will realize President Bill Clinton was fighting in Iraq also. (One of the most famous,in the 1990's, Operation Desert Storm).
BTW- Personally I like the president for some stuff, and I dont like him for some stuff, but I do want people to have reason and/or facts about why they make their opinion. :)
:whs: I agree with Carson, if you're going to "Voice" about something, that's fine, just get the facts straight and don't get them mixed up with your own opinions.
That's why I haven't posted much, I don't have / haven't researched it enough to keep myself from looking like a moron....... :)
Ghost MacRoth
12-06-07, 01:24 PM
I dont want to start a politics arguement, but what you said about his dad having money which kept him out of the Vietnam War is wrong.
George W. Bush was in the US National Guard, in which he serves on our soil, thus not going to Vietnam like the Army did.
Funny that, all the rich kids in the national gaurd, all the poor kids in the regular army. Mmmm. As I said, rich kids don't go to war, they will always get the easy option, even if, in extreme circumstances, he was sent to war, he'd be serving at the back, not the front.
Bush 1, bush 2, Clinton, does it matter? They are all politicians, and therefore inherantly corrupt. As Billy Connely once said, 'The desire to become a politician should immediately bar you from ever taking office.' A benign dictator is what we need, it's just a pity no such person exists.
I am a benign Dictator (whats benign) Well, in my Empire its free beer to everyone that can say ''Ace is stooopid''
Ghost MacRoth
12-06-07, 01:50 PM
Ace is stooopid!!
Benign (although I may have spelled it wrong) dictator is one who doesn't force his will on the people, he just sorta, knows better and puts it in a way everyone will listen and understand. If Ghandi had wanted, he coulda been one I recon.
Dam Lucy you just love bashing Ace
everyone does!! :p thats why threads go so :offtopic:
Well well, never noticed this quite disturbing tread lol well the beginning at least all that 9/11 talk....
but to the point first i would like to say that the quote from the Quran is false here is the correct chapter 9 verse 11:
["But if they repent and establish worship and pay the poor-due, then are they your brethren in religion. We detail Our revelations for a people who have knowledge."]
There are many fake sayings and quotes from the Quran please always fact check since this can lead to false opinions. http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/
Clearly a fake email as stated before but i would like to say that people like to claim that there is no such thing as conspiracy but don't know that many so called official facts are also conspiracy's ... like the actual 9/11 events if you have time you can watch a documentary about this on Google video for free "Loose Change" which asks some questions, a reply is available on youtube by government refuters.
And to my other point numbers don't speak they are only representing a value of something and yes 11 has been frequent in major events as the start or end of either wars or major political shifts... no one knows if that is because its after the summer break or because its the start of the end of the year and people would want to finish each other off... but so has 8, 9, 10, 12, etc and the end of WW2 May 8 which should be 11 based on the idea that its so important .... its just a coincidence imo.
Also good documentary which is less heavy then a 9/11 topic is: "Iraq for sale" which is also free full length on Google Video.
IrishKnight
14-09-07, 01:06 PM
;) thanks for clearing up the part bout the Quran m8..... so was the whole quote made up or is it really in there somewhere? also... it is human nature to look for/invent a pattern even if one does not exist... it is part of psychology that the human brain likes to find patterns/symbols/etc. when none are even present.. such as the face on Mars (just a hill) or the man on the moon (the face not the actual presence of man)... the list goes on forever..
No, no such thing anywhere in the Quran. first of all lands of Allah ?? that is not Islamic thinking Muslims say that everything is from and made by God without any discrimination.
Since 9/11 happened I was shocked that this happened. Like most people did think at the moment the first plane went in: how could that happen? Accident?
After the second plane it was clearly no accident.
I've seen a lot of "evidence" that it wasn't an terrorist action. Although I try to keep my mind by the facts, it's very hard. You see a lot of pro's and againsts on the internet wether it is a terrorist action or not.
Recently I read an article in a Dutch magazine which told a story about a huge American army base in Croatia/Servia (today it is still there). It told there were top secrets parts on the base (as usual). Also there would be a oilpipeline directly going to that base. Basicly the article said: America is going to war for oil. The base in Croatia/Servia is just there to get closer to Arabic country's where the most oil of the world can be found.
what ?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
from where u get this from Quran ?
anything u find it u put it
tell me ?
all this fake
what can i say more !!!!!
read my post(s) above abaza lol
And for the war its simple Iraq not involved with 9/11 that's it.
Saddam was a moderate socialist or you could say secular guy and it was widely known he did not like Al-Qaeda at all.... now the war was made on the bases that suddenly threats have been popping up and no more running after the perpetrators of 9/11, that's passé, Iraq WMD's is in...
Now that was a plain lie to go in there so what are the odds that the former ally Laden is enemy ?
A good secret service saying is "There is no such thing as quit."
I think that's the case here .... :/
It's even weirder when you see the movie final destination 3, there explain something ther, it is a movie yeah but the weirdets is, it does fit it.
EDIT: Funny movie watched the first or second one :) bloody stuff.
Whether or not the United States did go to Iraq for oil or not, we should always support our troops. They fight for our freedoms, not our politics. As for President Bush, he is a great president, just people expect him to work up miracles. After WWII, the U.S. implimented the Marshall Plan, bringing aid to the war torn nations of Europe. Same idea today in Iraq, made even harder by the fact that the country doesn't want aid and has a strong hatred toward the U.S. and an insurgency. The U.S. can't leave until the Iraqi Forces are strong enough to operate on their own, otherwise the nation will collapse, the terrorists will start gaining power, and 9/11 will look like a small spec of dust hitting your computer screen.
Why my friend, do Iraqi's hate America ? no but they do hate the governments policy.
Because America supports Israel above the UN, and caused the civil war in Iraq and funds death squad militias just because they want to be there to make tons of money for their personal pockets on the tax payers expense.
And if bush was the greatest president ? what is Catrina, Ghraib, Guantanamo, Secret bases that are above the law around the world, and making of Muslims as terrorists tools the same way Hitler picked on the poor Jews in Europe ?
And last but not least the patriot act.
Iraqi's don't hate america they hate bush and his cronies.
Ans so if America lied to its people about WAR then they also lied to the dead soldiers and those that are still fighting a lie of a war.
see the problem your not a honorable soldier if your a occupier... and you don't die with honor if what you where fighting for was money for someone else. honestly that is just another African war.
Watch Iraq for sale: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6621486727392146155&q=iraq+for+sale&total=359&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=0
Ghost MacRoth
16-09-07, 06:49 PM
:whs:
Doncha reckon the fact they don't want aid is enough to give the 'allies' the clue to leave??? Bush is a warmongering, money hungry, oil obsessed, monkey looking, c*ck. Also, the reason the troops can't leave is because the allied forces have CREATED the warzone they now patrol. Your blind patriotism may work in the States Allied', but here in Britain we are far more sceptical of the motives of those who sent the troops to fight and die in a war not even started by the Iraquis.
ye, i agree with Ghost. and the troops are coming no way. i've seen the meaningless onslaught with my own eyes. there's nothing we can do. they just pop up, shoot a grenade at us, and leave as fast as they came. and when people say that "we cant go home, they will follow us" then explain to me how a few sand-sucking guerillas are supposed to cross the biggest ocean on the earth?!
A few 'sand-sucking' guerillas HAVE crossed the SECOND largest ocean on the earth. Unless you've been living under a 50 ton rock for the past 10 years, 9/11 WAS caused by a group of 'sand-sucking' guerillas who took their religion to an extreme. No body believes in patriotism anymore, its just political bashing for popularity. Republicans vs. Democrats. H*ll, if we were invaded right now by anyone, there would be arguing for 10 days or more before we finally gave our military the go-ahead to fight back. If we got really lucky, there'd probably be a civil war between people who think the invasion is 'better than Bush's presidency', and those who want the United States of America to exist. Ghost, would you rather have the Iraqi's be living under a segregated dictatorship? Or give them a chance at democracy, where everyone is treated equally? Everyone takes everything for granted these days. The ability to bash your leader is a gift that cost us millions of lives to defend. Not something you find in your trash bin.
democracy, freedom, education, possibility and hope. thats what we have at home and what we try to give them. Money, money and yet more money, its what this war has turned out to be all about. Allied, it is not possible. NOT possible, to even try to start a democracy. The leaders of those lands have trough the centuries been taught NEVER to give away their power. It takes more than a couple western diplomats to turn their "culture" up-side down!
And if there ever was a chance to start bulding schools, its ruined now. its a bloody war down there, not a small conflict.
Right now we have no other option but to let them live in dictatorship. If we are to help them, we must get rid of their leaders, the ones that keeps the dictatorship going. And we can only do that trough acts of war.
excuse me but i think the reference sand sucking gorillas is offensive but to come to the point no Iraqis where not the ones that went to America on 9/11 and no Saddam was much better then US occupation its the fact that we are talking about a US occupation or a Iraqi one ? now Iran occupies the government and the US the streets how is that better ?
instead of looking at Iraq as a state of America remember that democracy is what you want to give them at least show an example and do that at home ... majority of Americans know the war is a lie and there is no patriotism in fighting for a lie knowingly.
and again sand sucking gorillas is completely uncalled for.
how can you call 300 million people something so repulsive ? nvm...
Ghost MacRoth
17-09-07, 05:07 PM
Allied', yes, yes I would. You can't beat someone into a democratic state, that's just silly. We (the allies) are an unwanted invading dictatorship in that region, how are we so different from before?? If you wanna talk about 'oh, but Saddam tortured and killed thousands of innocent Iraquis' I would say 'The occupying forces have tortured and bombed thousands of innocent Iraquis.' The problem I have with all this is the way the US government (in particular, but not exclusively) have made this look like a neccessary step towards stability, when in fact it was a major step towards radicalising a huge amount of people who may before have been moderate. After all, the US and it's citizens go MENTAL about 9/11, all those lives lost, and rightly so. Do you not think that those who die under allied munitions have family and friends who get just as mental??? This war has made things worse in the region, not better, and it was all for personal gain for those industrialist / politicians and their friends who control out 'democratic' govermnent.
And while we may be able to 'bash' our leader without consequence, it is simply to allow us the illusion of freedom in an ever more restrictive world. We are not free, we never were, we never will be, they just let us believe we are to shut us up.
Oh yeah, sand sucking guerrilas was a bit strong Lucy m'dear.
Ghost the anger over 9/11 and the need for revenge was already satisfied by invading Afghanistan! Iraq was a detour that instead of securing the US made the whole region unstable Iran now is the official supper power above Israel with missiles that can reach Italy and the nuclear war heads to boot..... now that the pro Arab Saddam is dead and the US is bogged down around Iran without it fearing them.
Iraq now as they say on the news has 90,000 al Qaeda armed supported who are Iraqi practically another death squad among so many in Iraq including American contractors...
Who joins these death squads? People either do so for money (lack of jobs) or because they are blinded by false hate and revenge.... easy pray for people that like to spill blood in their interest.
But to make this something new i would like to add that Afghanistan is not a success because America has sidelined the terrorists for petrol.... how patriotic is bush ??
http://priceofoil.org/wp-content/uploads/2007/03/war_pumps_textless_n_big.jpg
The United States has already passed the point of no return. You can't put a deadline on rebuilding after war, especially while terorrism is still going on. Imagine how many years it took for the U.S. to rebuild after the Revolutionary War. The First and Second World Wars. You can't rush these things; if you do the quality will be horrible, and people will STILL complain, "Why didn't we stay longer and help these people? Their lives are HORRIBLE!". Americans bash the government because of DEMOCRACY. Under a DICTATORSHIP, they would be hanged, killed, executed, tortured, you name it. Is that a kind of government you would rather have just because getting a democracy is, and always has been, hard?
Ghost MacRoth
17-09-07, 10:04 PM
At least dictatorships are honest. I'd rather know where I stand and be gagged, than be fooled into thinking my opinion mattered.
Majid, the anger and need for revenge over 9/11 will NEVER be satisfied, that's why it doesn't matter what country gets invaded, as long as they are.....dusky. Tarred with the same brush is an expression that comes to mind. You and I both know that Iraq and al quada are only linked by the letter Q. That's enough for the Bush administration, as they can spin it any old way to make it seem justified.
Oh yeah, sand sucking guerrilas was a bit strong Lucy m'dear.
might've been, but when you see how they fight, you understand. and if they fight against you, you'd understand even more.
I just want one thing said, there is no way everyone can be happy.
I dont think a country like that would have the ability to be democratic. because people doesnt thing like that. It just not how it works.
We want them to have democracy, freedom, we want them to threat women equally, no more forced marriages, etc...
But trough the centuries, its just like that it has been working in their lands,
we cannot force our culture over to them.
excuse me Lucy but i am not only an arab I am also a muslim, and forced marriages is to men and women and is in sharp decline since its a cultural thing and not religious.
and no "they fight" is ignorant to the point that they are not an army like America or the uk Saddam fought in the old fashioned way and got defeated on the second try by the coalition after heavy sanctions...
And for democracy i would like to point out that Palestine Lebanon have fair democracy's and tolerance.
Hamas was voted in free and fair.
all humans are equal there is no savages in this world or lower cast people.
Sure about what ?
that all humans are equal and that there are no lesser humans then others ?
Sure about what ?
that all humans are equal and that there are no lesser humans then others ?
I think you misunderstood.
I never said people werent equal, I said many people in the middle-eastern areas says so.
from everything i have seen in the middle-eastern, it looks like a bully-controlled sandbox.
well most people just see dead body's and people at the brink...
lets imagine what people see outside Arabia ....
http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/english/doc/2005-09/28/xin_310902272023710171507.jpg
that would be the usual picture ....
but that is only in that area of suffering in the rest of Arabia hopefully not going to be like that is like this:
http://p.vtourist.com/336991-Skyscrapers_in_Dubai-Dubai.jpg
http://www.hotels-dubai.ae/luxury-hotels-united-arab-emirates/img/tours/12.jpg
http://www.dubaiinformer.com/uploaded_images/Sheikh-Zayed-Road-2004-Dubaiinformer.jpg
Ghost MacRoth
18-09-07, 08:38 PM
But Majid, those pictuires are...
A: not likely to be newsworthy
B: not likely to panick people into supporting maniacs like Bush
So c'mon, get serious!!! It's all sand, and burning oilwells, and blown up buildings we wanna see, isn't it?? ;)
btw i added that building with the ball shape for one reason because its one ***** building its my ..... ISP. ;)
And i know Ghost, nothing is news worthy except some poorly funded and run madrasa or a car bomb or a crazy guy like Sadr ranting how he fights for Iraqis while performing irans will...
And for the dictatorship of arabs heres a short video on that subject:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LTKDtiD-eAY
Note at the end the dictators where forced on the people because they unfortunately sat on black gold that was in the eyes of another.
The borders where drawn up by occupiers again this might sound similar to Iraq since the major decisions are handled by occupiers today... but there was one more blow to humanity and that was that Britain that ruled most of Arabia (except for Lebanon and Syria which where run by France), the United Kingdom gave in a change of policy Palestine to a foreign dictator instead of a local one.
http://www.semp.us/_images/biots/Biot398PhotoD.jpg
I just remembered something I read in school about why the Middle-East is so -REMOVED- up right now, after the UK lost control of the area (left), they didn't divide through religion, which is what fuels most of the attacks, but just made boundaries into nice little countries. Technically (very technically) the problem in the Middle-East is partly the UK's fault, and the US is stuck cleaning after them :P
Ghost MacRoth
18-09-07, 09:48 PM
Yup, that's right allied', the US to the rescue again. Don't suppose you noticed any other troops in the middle east?? Like the europeans the US frequently bomb by mistake?? The UK took more casualties from 'friendly fire' from the Yanks than from the Iraquis in the first 6 months of the war. And if you think the US is blameless in setting up dictators like SAddam, you best check your facts. The US sold as many guns in the region if not more than the UK.
Also, you are aware that Osama Bin Laden was initially supported, supplied, funded, and trained by the CIA in order to fight the Russians aren't you? But yeah, you're right, Uncle Sam to the rescue!! :rolleyes:
Yes, but the UK did divide the region into what it is today. I'm not saying the UK started the war, but it certainly did add fuel to the fire. The US isn't innocent of that either, supporting Isreal apparently also made it worse. Uncle Sam DID fund Osama Bin Laden, we didn't take notice of him as a threat because the Russians were much more of a danger. Back then during the Cold War, an invasion by the USSR was much more likely than a terrorist attack, on US soil. Technically, we aided the Afghans and Osama in repulsing the USSR, which didn't give them more territory in Europe. After the unsuccessful invasion of Afghanistan, the economic and military toll aided in the fall of the USSR. Friendly Fire by the US is usually made by faulty coordinates or other information; USAF pilots aren't bombing the UK's troops on purpose.
US mass production in WWII greatly aided the UK during the Battle of Britan; those who say that we did not do anything, the glorious UK would have regained just enough strength to liberate Europe on its own are wrong. The US also provided aid to post-war Europe in the Marshall Plan. Could the Brits have rebuilt Europe after liberating it?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_invasion_of_Afghanistan
true UK started it but... but the uk has been superseded by America entirely in the region mostly since 1950 this means that America has arm wrestled Briton out of the region and into the sidelines... good example of this is the Iranian revolution or Iranian problem as it is today.
Iran was run by a moderate non religious guy called, Mohammed Mosaddeq (19 May 1882 – 5 March 1967) served as the Prime minister of Iran from 1951 to 1953. He was democratically elected to the parliament, and as leader of the nationalists was twice appointed as prime minister by Mohammad Reza Pahlavi, the Shah of Iran, after a positive vote of inclination by the parliament. Mossadegh was a nationalist and passionately opposed foreign intervention in Iran. He was also the architect of the nationalization of the Iranian oil industry, which had been under British control through the Anglo-Iranian Oil Company, today known as British Petroleum (BP).
He was over thrown by CIA crack troops after the UK asked the US for help, because the United Kingdom did not want to give iran more of its oil......... which they have not right to occupy.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/68/28mordad1332.jpg
Operation Ajax CIA crack troops in front of Iran's parliament.
Tehran on 19 August 1953.
But as the US over threw him they did not give Iran back to the Brits ... no they forgot about them and removed democracy entirely and made the King/shah the absolute power who was their friend but shackled by democracy.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/c/c6/Mohammadreza_Shah.jpg
US installs Shah of Iran as the de facto dictator of Iran...
Now Europe completely angry at this as you can imagine, don't sit on the side line but instead support Ayatollah khomeini to destroy instead of sit around while America sucks Iran dry... Ayatollah Khomeini was in Paris making propaganda until he flew to Iran to seal the revolution.....
It is also known that he was closely in contact with franc's secret service. Example:
"According to Alexandre de Marenches, chief of External Documentation and Counter-Espionage Service (now known as the DGSE), France would have suggested to the shah to "organise a fatal accident for Khomeini"; the shah declined the assassination offer, as that would have made Khomeini a martyr."
Today the Islamic republic of Iran is doing open business and has open tourism to Europe and businesses from the EU but no formal relations with the United States or anyone from there.
Operation Ajax was concieved by the UK; they asked President Truman for assistance but he declined. They asked again when Eisenhower came into presidency, and he said yes. The UK orchestrated the plan; the CIA put it into action.
"This (probably unrealistic) fear of communist takeover was played on by the British and Iranians to encourage US support"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Ajax
I said that but you didnt read the point there was no comunist take over in iran that was part of the smoke screen...
"The government of Britain had grown increasingly distressed over Mossadegh's policies and were especially bitter over the loss of their control of the Iranian oil industry. Repeated attempts to reach a settlement had failed.
Unable to resolve the issue singlehandedly due to its post-World War II problems, Britain looked towards the United States to settle the issue. The United States was led to believe by the British that Mossadegh was increasingly turning towards Communism and was moving Iran towards the Soviet sphere at a time of high Cold War fears.
Acting on the opposition to Mossadegh by the British government and fears that he was, or would become, dependent on the pro-Soviet Tudeh Party at a time of expanding Soviet influence, the United States and Britain began to publicly denounce Mossadegh's policies for Iran as harmful to the country."[link] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohammed_Mossadegh#Plot_to_depose_Mossadegh)
Because of UK strong arming him he would not refuse and this was in a time that you had a breath of air if you did since USSR gave competition... US attacked him on the bases that failed negotiation made him sway towards Russia that was a unstable but less colonial ally...
Miaerten
18-09-07, 10:53 PM
Its all the fault of filty America, i hate bush and his gummibears
Ghost MacRoth
19-09-07, 12:32 PM
I think what this stream of posts has concluded is this:
The western powers through greed and in-fighting have utterly -REMOVED- up the entire middle east.
And that's still going on today. Sad really.
Oh yeah Allied'? I don't think the Brit's could have rebuilt Europe alone, as they would never have conquered it alone. Yup, the US helped out. A little late in getting to the party, but undoubtedly usefull!! ;)
yes but even the germans acknowledged that the Ost front was more dangerous then the west ... not that it matters America helped out where it was needed and everyone is proud of the soldiers that fought over there :)
K topic get closed if i see this again, stop using cursed words on a public forum, i mean this too a letter and then this ****** behind it.
In comparison to the Conspiracy, Counter-Conspiracy arguments about 9/11, where one side starts yelling while the other defends, I think this argument has been a neat mature one :) Everyone attacked with facts, not opinions. Amazing how a clan can sitll be mature and 'polite' during an argument or debate.
To sum this up partially, the US has many questions it needs to answer about the reason(s) for going into Iraq, when Afghanistan was the main target. The US, UK, and other major nations have all played their parts in ruining the peace of the Middle-East, and it will probably be irreversable. 9/11 will always remain a mystery and a hugely debated topic, like Pearl Harbor or the JFK Assassinations, mainly because of many unanswered questions.
Anything else?
Well that sums it up except by claiming that the UK/US occupy the middles east is irreversible is not the case in fact they are entirely to blame for the animosity that arabs and muslims have against them... so in short America and uk are terror makers since occupying and destroying the middle east is bound to make the populace hostile to you and maybe a fringe group even radical.
And for Afghanistan it was a pretty straight forward plan.
But lets not forget why the US went in Iraq:
1 Iraq was having suddenly WMD's that are a imminent (roughly 48 Hours) threat to America:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bNws6IG696M
And 2 Saddam was linked to Al qaeda:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f_A77N5WKWM
Later on since this was a lie bush administration and friends went on to claim that Saddam was a bloody dictator and that he just needed to be deposed...
basically the charges where: Kurdi massacre, Shia revolt massacre, Assassination punishment:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N3hRaDye4zA
What this X-CIA guy is saying is simple as 1-2-3 not one person claims Hiroshima nuke is illegal since its in a war right? ie. collateral damage... since Saddam was in war with Iran in which 1 million soldiers died now count the amount of collateral damage when the fighting came to city areas like in the case of the Kurdish massacre you will see that there is little deaths among the civilians and many more among the soldiers... and neither the Iranians or the Iraqis targeted the civilians.
Shia revolt is basic stuff shia are wiped up by the west to rebel against their government. Iraq sends in soldiers Saddam kills the armed rebellion and kills a lot of them to make sure they learn a lessen... Saddam ruled in a soviet fashion.
Assassination punishment... they attempt to kill him he kills all the suspected people since it was a well planed large attempt to assassinate Saddam if it where not for the unplanned stop at a pharmacy and switch of cars in the motorcade the plan would have worked.
...
If you remember Mossadeq you will understand this picture....
http://www.husseinhanging.com/_img/saddam-hanging.jpg
While Bush and co. enjoy ranches and record profits on tax payers dollars... the rest are either already as the bellow picture suggest or not too far from it.
http://i106.photobucket.com/albums/m265/soldior/IraqCoffin.jpg
Ghost MacRoth
20-09-07, 11:28 AM
Majid, that was quality. The first video is a perfect example of 'spin' (known to non political types as LIES) as it runs 'yeah, they've definetly got them, well, we think they've definetly got them, well, they are capable of making them, erm, well, they are trying to get them, well, they could have had them!!'
The second, oh how good it is to see him squirm!!! Lying sod can't disguise the fact he is not even close to being honest!!
The third, a perfect example of the 'unreported world' that exists around us. You rarely hear people like that in news reports, and if you do, they are either dismissed as kooks, silenced with a smear campaign, or just ignored.
I think that just about says it all!! Go ahead Wes, close the thread dude, 'cause NO-ONE can top that I don't think!! Unless you got some more vids to show Majid?
Updated :)
And not really nothing much those videos cover the basics longer or some other videos go in detail about other things.
Oh come on, I was trying to reach an agreement in the most non-biased sentence I could think of...I was hoping you'd understand that...I asked for more non-biased summaries, not evidence.
Yes, i know and i commend you for that. :)
but... i had to mention it because, its not nice to hear someone say that occupation is irreversible when one knows that the US was occupied, and how they suffered under that, and longed for freedom from oppression and injustice.
IrishKnight
22-09-07, 04:32 PM
aye Majid you are a man of great wisdom ;) but i just hope this whole thing isn't going to be one massive arguement :o
The only time I can think of that the US was ever occupied may have been during the Revolutionary War and the War of 1812. Are those the two you were talking about?
I was referring to the American Revolutionary War, from the United Kingdom.
Well, just a bit of trivia ;) During the War of 1812, it was the only time in American History when an organized enemy army had ever landed on American soil.
that is amazing not many major country's can claim that in fact maybe noone else can ?
Maybe Japan had only Americans because Chinese crashed at sea ....
Ghost MacRoth
24-09-07, 07:50 PM
Well, just a bit of trivia ;) During the War of 1812, it was the only time in American History when an organized enemy army had ever landed on American soil.
Except of course when the europeans arrived in the first place and invaded th indigeonous American Indian population. ;)
But then i thought of Australia... but Ghost got one for that too i guess lol
Ghost MacRoth
25-09-07, 12:00 PM
Australia. Well, that'd be the Europeans again eh? Although I'm sure the Mauri's (Mowries? Mauwries? whatever....) had a bit of a go at them too.
vBulletin® v3.8.4, Copyright ©2000-2012, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.